Cuban Sky Getting Pinker by the minute.
I'll try to keep this post more civil so that I don't have to remove it.
Anyways, once you get used to Rie's mom, she's quite humorous. Not in the "laughing with her" meaning, but definitely in the "laughing at her" sense. For instance, this last Sunday, when we were eating lunch before going out house hunting, Rie's mom made some comment about "later, if God blesses you with a baby." I was immediately reminded of the Calvin and Hobbes cartoon where Calvin's dad tells Calvin they won't decorate the tree and will just leave it in the garage "Then on Christmas Day," his dad says "if you get a present...." "If I get a present?" Calvin responds, horrified. Anyways, I just had to laugh at the idea that "possibly" in a while Rie and I might have "a" baby.
But aside from that, things went quite well. After seeming somewhat averse initially to my insistance that $400,000 was too much and that we should start by looking at things closer to $250,000, she quickly opened up and showed us some 1 bed, 1 bath condos (all we need for now, really).
I wouldn't say it's pink... more like coral. And a lovely shade, at that. =p
ReplyDeleteHonestly, I saw nothing wrong with her saying "if God blesses us with a baby".
In truth, we don't know WHAT God has in store for us, so saying something with an "if" as opposed to a "when" isn't a bad thing. It's not like she doesn't expect us not to have children.
You really should try to be less analytical... it's starting to grate on the nerves.
But at least you were more optimistic about the whole house hunting thing this time around. For a while, I didn't think I'd be able to pull you out of the pessimistic phase. One step at a time, I suppose.
And thank you for keeping this post civil. =) You are once again worthy of sleeping on the couch. (For those of you completely baffled by this last sentence, please refer to The Resident Murloc's comment posted here.)
=p
~RlrlrlRLRLLRLGRLGRLGlglglglgl!~
I suppose the one draw back to being a pessimist is when you finally are realistic about a dire situation (So. Cal. housing market) people just assume your being pessimistic.
ReplyDeleteTruthfully, I'm not sure your mom does expect us to have children. While I'm sure she was just phrasing it like that to avoid upsetting you and making you feel pressured, I can't help but think back to the first thing Elizabeth said after we got engaged: "don't have any kids for several years after your married because having children too soon could do irrepairable damage to your relationship." Yeah, because the marriages of my mom and dad, Jen and Greg, Phil and Rachel, Paul and Brenda, Jeff and Liz, and Cari and Sam are SO rocky. I'm amazed they've all lasted this long (*rolls eyes*).
It was a bit of a shock when Sam and I found out after two months of married life that we were (are) expecting our first baby. But let me tell you, we are soooo excited and cannot wait for the arrival of this little one! Just let God work in your life, and His blessings will flow.
ReplyDeleteI can understand waiting to have children for a time, but really, it is an awesome miracle that will change your whole perspective on life. It will also enrich your marriage and your faith.
Here's to Catholic Family Life!! God bless you, Joe and Rie! May you have many children.
Congratulations, Cari and Sam! I didn't know you were expecting. God bless all three of you!
ReplyDeleteJoe's dad and I had planned to wait a couple of years after we got married before we started our family. I, in particular, wanted to wait because I had a good and somewhat prestigious job that I was good at, that paid well, that I enjoyed very much, that gave me a great deal of personal satisfaction, and that made me feel important. But as they say, our plans gave God a good laugh. Jenny was conceived about three months after our wedding, and of course, God's plan was vastly better than ours. As soon as we saw Jenny we knew that we wouldn't have given her up for anything. I believe having a child so soon strengthened our marriage, prevented us from getting too used to having things our own way all the time, and certainly helped me to begin to become less self-centered, to learn humility, and to grow up!
I hope God blesses you and Rie with children soon, Joe, and I know that if you let Him He will certainly work through your children to bring you closer to Him and to each other, as you and Sam are probably already finding out, Cari.
"Truthfully, I'm not sure your mom does expect us to have children."
ReplyDeleteYou really are quite negative. So sad. =\
"While I'm sure she was just phrasing it like that to avoid upsetting you and making you feel pressured,"
News flash! I have been feeling pressured... by everyone save my family! Truthfully, it makes me feel very alone and like I'm the bad guy. You have no idea what that does to someone's psyche. Thankfully, and due in part to my past (but that will be reserved for another time), my psyche has grown quite tough and calloused. I've learned to take a beating.
"I can't help but think back to the first thing Elizabeth said after we got engaged: "don't have any kids for several years after your married because having children too soon could do irrepairable damage to your relationship."
Key word: could. From my understanding, "could" is not an absolute. She never said it WOULD.
Good Lord... I think I am ready for children, what with all the patience I've had to achieve in the past 1.5 years.
"I, in particular, wanted to wait because I had a good and somewhat prestigious job that I was good at, that paid well, that I enjoyed very much, that gave me a great deal of personal satisfaction, and that made me feel important."
Glad to know that my view, which is essentially this right now, isn't an evil brought on by Belzabub. (I was starting to get that feeling the way everyone kept talking about it.) =\
And just to put everyone's minds at ease *cough*Joe*cough*, yes, we will have children. It may happen tomorrow, or it may happen in two years. But, personally, I'm not particularly fond of rushing or being rushed.
As so many are fond of saying... God has a plan. Patience is a virtue and can do wonders in helping to wait to see what that plan will be. =)
Oh, and Joe... it's spelled "you're", not "your". Oh wait... I forgot... aria man cna't spel. =p
~RlrlrlRLRLLRLGRLGRLGlglglglgl!~
HURRY! HAVE CHILDREN NOW! OR ELSE! PRESSURE! CHILDREN! NOW! YOU MUST COMPLY! RESISTANCE IS FUTILE!
ReplyDeleteRelevant Futurama Quote:
Kif: "Oh, this is the happiest moment of my life! You all brought such wonderful gifts! But the greatest gift is the bond I share with my smizmar Amy. And soon, the quivering mass of life within me will depend on us both." [He rubs his stomach.] "Even now I can sense it feeding, squirming, searching, questing and shortly, it will rend my loins in twain and pull us down, down, down into the deep dark waters of commitment."
Resistance is futile. Have a nice day.
ReplyDelete~RlrlrlRLRLLRLGRLGRLGlglglglgl!~
Murloc,
ReplyDelete(An aside, what is a murloc anyway? Yes, I know that I'm showing my ignorance and am again knocking myself down on Joe's cool meter.)
I recall a good friend of mine recommending that Jen and I should wait one year before we have children. Now, after about 5 years of marriage, I think he's wrong, though I'm sympathetic to why he said it.
Amongst Catholics I've known, there are two opposite, incorrect sides to this havin' babies thing, 1.) have children right away, or else you'll burn baby burn, and 2.) wait a few years until you're stable and feel ready. In camp 1, I've known of people who belittle some couples for having just 2 or 3 children--as if 5 is the minimum set up by Holy Tradition.
There is certainly some vailidity to #2 (think responsible parenthood), but it can be more dangerous. I think that Mom B's comments relate to that potential danger. Each couple (and each spouse) has to ask the following question, "What are the reasons we have for postponing pregnancy?" If my list of reasons begins with:
1.) I want ...
2.) I want ...
3.) I want ...
then something may be wrong with my reasons. If my list is comprised of things that will lead to my personal comfort with the future (i.e., financial stability, not personally ready at present, I want more time), then I certainly need to do some serious soul searching to know whether or not my reasons are just. I speak from experience because I had to do some of this difficult soul searching. All of my choices should aim towards the service of my family--present and future.
Nobody should pressure you into having children ASAP (such as camp 1 people I mentioned above), but a nebulous "someday we'll have children" is also bad (it's worse IMO), even if you set a limit on the number of years you wait.
Pray, reflect, and do God's will. If you do that (there's a peace that comes when you do), then you won't likely be irritated by pressure from anybody, regardless of how hard they press.
--Greg of Jen & Greg
Joe,
ReplyDeleteI think that some of your comments about your mother-in-law are unfair. What grandparent DOESN'T want to have grandchildren? I can't think of a single one.
--Greg of Jen & Greg
Parents pressuring us to have kids? Who, my parents? No... Nah... Never...
ReplyDeleteYeah right.
Liz and I not only did not appreciate but also severely had disgust for my parents uncaring selfish desire for us to produce a child. No, really, I don't think they cared one way or another whether we could a) afford or b) handle the extra stress of bringing a child into the world.
Gee... Blue fox, you are coming down really harsh against your child's grandparents... or am I. Liz and I have not been able to attend any function in public with my parents since we were married without them making some type of negative comment or sharp remark pertaining to when we were to produce a child. It got to the point where we did not only not want to go in public with them since we did not appreciate their attatude towards our marriage as existing without children around.
No matter how "soft" a nudge they may have thought they were giving us, we didn't find it fun or gentle or humorous in any way.
So, yeah, Rie I know how you feel and Joe, I totally understand your reactions and tone of the discussion. Since, it is not as if you are never planning on having children... but by no means should your parents be the ones creating the plans for you and your wife.
God's blessings happen when it is proper and not when man desires... for God does allow man to make decisions without him and they are all sinful. So in God's time is the only time things ought to take place.
As to my parents... they've cooled off. They now have a grandchild and have started treating us with greater respect, more "as parents" and less "as married children".
I could say more, but I've vented enough past frustration for now.
~The Blue Fox
Oh... forgot to mention types of stress before the baby:
ReplyDeleteLiz suffering from high blood pressure and panic attacks (one taking us to the hospital)
Liz's father undergoing quintuple heart bypass surgery
One of Liz's sisters donating a kidney then the following year her other sister undergoing major kidney surgery (it was almost gone but now functions at 30%, but her involentary 1.3 kidnies is still more then the volentary single kidney.)
Financial issues and downsizing of my previous business group: potential mass layoff. (averted through switching business groups)
God desides to enter a baby... and take Liz's father.
Plus numerous other crazy stress issues to complicate blood pressure problems. (oh... but somehow, Liz's blood pressure is within the normal realm now.)
So there are some legitimate reasons not to pump out children right away.
~the blue fox
You don't know what a Murloc is???????? GUH!
ReplyDeleteI refuse to speak to you ever again...
.....
Ok, ok, so i'll still speak to you, even if you are ignorant to what a Murloc is. So, to rectify this, let me educate you. =)
A Murloc is a sentient fish-man creature, with a nasty disposition, that come in all sorts of colors and sizes. hey can be found in the World of Warcraft near water, be it oceans or bogs or lakes. If you get anywhere near them or their camp, they will attack you... and not just one, but the whole tribe! They whack at you with clubs, claws, and sharp metalic or bone weapons. And they make this gurgling noise, that has been described as gurlging a mouthful of yoghurt. (It's roughly spelled: RlrlrlRLRLLRLGRLGRLGlglglglgl.)
Here are some visual and auditory samples for Murlocs:
Murloc picture
Murloc sound (coming soon... as soon as I upload it)
And there is your education on Murlocs!
- - - - - - - - - -
As for the topic at hand, I have been praying about said topic. I've been praying since the day I got married. So that's not really an issue.
It may be due to the fact I really didn't have much to go on when I was growing up. It may be that since I am actually able to live now, fully growing up isn't such an attractive deal. But growing up will happen as it does to everyone, and at that time I will deal with it (hell, I'll have 9 months to come to grips with it). And I've had plenty of experience in the past to know what NOT to grow up into (so don't you all worry your pretty little heads off about THAT).
Yes, I have my ups and downs about the whole feeling pressured thing (sometimes I feel like smashing people's faces into walls, and other times I just don't give a hoot and ignore them all together... I think this wholey revolves around certain times of the month... lol).
But, as I mentioned before up there somewhere, patience is a virtue. And patience and prayer is what I'm on right now (man, I make it sound like some sort of drug or something).
Blue Fox - Thank you for that. You've essentially put into words what I could not. Thankfully, I haven't had the parents directly in my face with a "must have children now" attitude, but I have still felt a silent pressure along those lines.
I think sometimes parents forget that they too can be selffish in the whole "you must have children now" syndrome. It's one of those things where everyone needs to reflect and come to an understanding that each side already has a plan written in God's Hand. There's no turning from it. If He has decreed it, tough noogies, it's gonna happen.
(Sorry you had to go through all that, Fox. I can sympathize. It's unfortunate that only when the baby came did your parents actually back off and start treating you and Liz properly.)
Well, when all is said and done, God will bestow upon us children when he feels the time is right. And so far, it hasn't happened, therefore He must not feel the time is right. And since it hasn't happened yet, why should we stop with our financial gain or finding a home? That'd be kinda dumb, and I doubt God would want that. We'll keep moving forward. Forward is so much better than going backwards or being still. =)
~RlrlrlRLRLLRLGRLGRLGlglglglgl!~
Dear ones --
ReplyDeleteIt makes me really sad to see how much anxiety, stress, and anger the subject of having children has caused many of you. Parenthood -- which often starts by causing terror at the news of a positive pregnancy test (I should know) -- is a great adventure and the source of the greatest joy many of us will know in this life. Of course it is hard (and scary) -- everything worthwhile is. But it is tragic that the mere idea of it is causing you so much more suffering than necessary, because of real or perceived pressure from others, fear, and friction where there should be harmony.
Joe and Rie, I hope I have never put any pressure on either of you about having children. That must be a decision between you two and God. Of course I would love to have more grandchildren, but that isn't up to me, is it? It is possible that you won't even be able to have children, although I certainly hope you don't have to experience that wrenching sorrow. But only God knows what lies in store for any of us.
My chief wish for both of you -- and also the rest of you, Jeff & Liz, Jenny & Greg, Cari & Sam, Dave [& whoever] (& even Tom & Ileana, although they haven't gotten into this conversation yet), and any and all offspring -- is that you find the joy that only comes from trying always and above all to do God's will. Trust God. He really is in control. Embrace whatever He sends you as coming from His love for you. If you do that, your lives & marriages will be strong and happy and holy, whatever happens.
I pray for all of you that you will find the peace and deep joy that comes from a total surrender to God's loving providence. You are all destined by God for glory in heaven, and I look forward to seeing you reigning in splendor. I pray every day that you will become saints. (Pray for me that I do, too!)
Love,
Mom B
More from Mom B (oh, no!):
ReplyDeleteRie, thanks for your post. Your attitude is just right. Prayer and patience are exactly what is needed. You'll be fine!
You're right that it's up to God to decide when to have children. I NEVER felt comptetent to say, "OK, now's the time to become responsible for another helpless infant!" My personal attitude was always just to let God decide and not get in His way -- and trust Him to help me not to make a mess of things.
About growing up -- it really is a lot more fun to be an adult than a child. I hate it whenever anybody says to a teen, "These are the best times of your life!" That's a lie. I always tell them, "Hang in there -- adulthood is MUCH better!" I found childhood -- especially adolescence -- really difficult, and had a much better life once I finally felt like an adult and became independent and responsible for myself (at least after I found Mike). When I also figured out that it was up to me to do what I thought was right, and that it didn't really matter what other (uninvolved) people thought -- even if they thought I was an idiot -- I felt so much more free.
Keep moving forward! It gets better!
The Murloc is pleased. =)
ReplyDeleteThe Murloc is now happy and content, and has done away with the annoying stressed-out-feeling (of course, current job is another matter entirely along the stress- factor lines... but a new, more fun job starts on Wednesday... EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!)
The Murloc will now be at peace and move forward, living life to it's fullest (and not have urges to claw the eyes out of beings that get too close to it's little hut by the ocean's edge).
The Murloc thanks all involved for being so patient and understanding.
The Murloc does not feel lonely anymore.
=D
~RlrlrlRLRLLRLGRLGRLGlglglglgl!~
Rie,
ReplyDeleteAre you sure that those Murlocs only set up camp near water? I swore that I saw one of them on the American University campus. (at least I saw some dude with hair like that)
--Greg of Jen & Greg
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteMethinks the spouses should delete their personal posts and have this conversation in private....
ReplyDeleteHey, who cancelled my favorite soap?
ReplyDeleteThe Murloc will no longer contribute to this coverstaion.
ReplyDeletePeace out.
~RlrlrlRLRLLRLGRLGRLGlglglglgl!~
I haven't viewed these comments in awhile because of pregnancy complications (we thought we were losing the baby). Thankfully, though, we were able to view our baby and his or her heartbeat via ultrasound today. It was soooo exciting! I can't put it into words. It also allowed me to finally breathe a sigh of relief after a week of agonizing worry...
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mom B that all the fear, pressure, and frustration some of you are feeling should not be factors in planning your family. God gave each couple the ability to plan their family naturally, and many variables must be taken into account so that the baby and the parents will not be overwhelmed by the new life. Family planning must be approached first of all prayerfully and practically, but prayer and practicality should never be exclusive.
Rie, I can identify with your feelings a lot. I am the oldest of nine children, and I was always the more independent one who wanted to strike out into the world and really live. At one time, I did not even want children...ever (age 17). I have never had a motherly inclination, unlike my sister, who just loves kids. Now, of course, I love kids too, but that doesn't mean I feel ready to be a mother.
In fact, I am scared and unsure of what kind of mother I will be, and I definitely don't feel 110% ready to be a parent. But it doesn't matter. God has planned this path for Sam and me. Every day I grow in confidence in my role, and every day I embrace my motherhood more. Even now I wouldn't trade it for anything. There is a miracle inside of me! The point: God makes you ready. Without Him, you never will be.
I think one thing we have to keep in mind is the example of the Holy Family. Look at all of the troubles and difficulties that laced their early familyhood. Mary was a single mom whose future husband could have had her stoned. Joseph was an older man who found out his wife was pregnant with a child who wasn't his. With troubles like those, I am sure their financial status was the least of their concerns. They were forced to travel to Bethlehem, where they did not even have a place to stay (but they didn't worry about having a nice enough dwelling). Their mode of transportation was a humble mule. They were dirt poor. After Christ was born, they were forced to flee blindly to Egypt, with whatever possessions they could carry, and start over in a new land.
The point is: Mary didn't stress about her pregnancy, and Joseph didn't give in to frustration about stepping in as father. They simply trusted in God. Mary had the choice to say no to being a mother, just as all Catholic couples have the choice to say no to being parents. Before you become so stressed out at the prospect of being parents, look to the role models who are to inspire us. Though they had a rough time, they simply trusted in God. And Joseph worked hard to provide for his family. And Mary dedicated her life to the One Who is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. That was "really living."
Your moms and dads have every right to look forward to the grandchildren that you will provide for them. They know the miracle of life and wait with joyful anticipation for you to experience the miracle of parenthood, and to experience the miracle of grandparenthood themselves. This is not a selfish desire, but a beautiful one, borne of experiencing God's gift of life themselves.
I will tell you something that I want you all to think carefully about. My mother and father have always wanted grandchildren, and as soon as we were ready. This gentle "pressure" was not lost on us, mainly for one reason: my Mom has cancer. She may not be here very long to enjoy her grandchildren. But I wanted her to be a grandma and to experience that great blessing before leaving this earth. You really and honestly cannot say how long your parents will be in this world (or how long you will be, either). Why put off miracles for days when you cannot share them with those you love the most? Why take the chance?
I think one dangerous mentality that has not been pointed out is this: if you wait to have children until you feel completely, 110% ready to be parents, you may always come up with "reasons" for delay and end up never having children. About a year ago, 60 Minutes had a special on how an increasing number of women in their 40s, who had dedicated their lives to work and "really living," suddenly awakened to their desire to have children. Unfortunately, due to age, they could not. To hear these women's stories was heartbreaking.
And there are statistics. A woman's fertility decreases significantly around age 28. That really leaves a very small window for creating new life.
So what is it that is really hindering you? Fear? Trust in God. Finances? Work hard and trust in God. Pressure from family? Look at that pressure for what it really is: encouragement to welcome a miracle into your lives and theirs. Not ready? You never will be until you are a parent, so let go and let God.
An article to back up some claims I made: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/health/thehealthnews.html?in_article_id=362532&in_page_id=1797
ReplyDelete